Here it is..

http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/News/new...illance-system/


Now.. all this roads where they are going to install all this..
I bet all this new thing…is because of loud exhausts and not because some bikers (not all) use the selected roads as race tracks.. (like the Cat&Fiddle)

Typical MCN bollocks.

But I understand they are fitting microphones around Andover to catch people with loud exhauts

I dont live there anymore Paul..heheheh

but yeh, I thought the same, MCN again..
even if they can identify that it is a bike goin over the sensors on the road, they would have to put cameras as well to identify the plates, or else the system wouldnt work..

TBH I think we've brought this on ourselves

Clearly we can't be trusted (simply because of a small number of kamikaze pricks) not to take the piss and the inevitable seems to be happening

I’m not a fan of cameras at all, but frankly given that these muppets seem hell bent on ruining these routes for everyone, I’m not surprised this is happening

The next thing of course will be proper type approval where we're not allowed to change anything on the bike...
and at that point I will be firmly pointing the finger at that JP bloke who's clearly hell bent on sending us all to hell

Italics not to be taken seriously

What the hell have you got against Italics? some of my best friends come from Italy

but you know when I pointed out the thing about not being allowed to change anything on a bike was because that's what happened in Portugal with modded cars...
Street racing is a big thing over there and it's almost like watching fast&furious in real life.. of course it doesnt happen during rush hour and it's usually done after 2am on some areas...
but as police couldnt make it stop the law now doesnt allow to change anything on a car... exhausts, tinted windows, spoilers, different bumpers.. you can't even change the pedals or fit a sporty gear knob..
The local DVLA even has lorries fitted with rolling roads.....they'll stop you on the side of the road, put your car in, if you have more bhp than standard, the car is impounded.

And are they going to spend a fortune on digging up roads to put sensors in them?

Naaaaaaa, of course not....

I am quite concerend as "why speed or speeding" is now seen as such a major crime in this country,
are we all being slowly brainwashed by the fun police,
and will the new adrenalin rush now be to see how many things we can stop from happening?.
Isnt speed and speeding irelevant,
we have speed limits set on the roads of the UK which date back to the early or mid 60's when cars of that era did not have the braking capacity for their engines.
Excess of 70mph on UK roads is seen as dangerous because of excess speed,
where as speeds of 70mph+ on the autobahn are relatively slow but are also dangerous because of failure to keep up with the flow of traffic.
we need faster speeds on the likes of motorways and duel carrageways!.

How do you figure that?

Some car drivers have been driving like pricks for years but they have never seen fit to put a system like this in place for them.

It is blatant discrimination against bikers plain and simple (if indeed it happens) and should be fought against tooth and nail if we are not to find ourselves driven off the roads to save us annoying car drivers by being able to overtake, filter and other such anti-social behaviour

An idiot is an idiot no matter how many cameras are around and all that will happen is they will ride elsewhere and, surprise surprise, this insidious destruction of liberties will creep across the country the same as average speed cameras have.

On roads such as the Cat and Fiddle I would think the speed limits are irrelevant - you could be riding/driving far too fast without breaking the speed limit which I think is the Nationl Speed Limit ie 60mph!

true, but the twonk to non twonk ratio is far higher and the non leisure usage far far lower on bikes, especially I would guess in an area as famous as the cat and fiddle on a hot summer weekend.

Its a bit like the peer 2 peer filesharing protocols on the internet, there are perfectly legal uses of it however most is likely to be illegal. ISPs are already filtering some of it and there are calls from some for the protocol to be blocked altogther!

Given some of the stuff I see people doing every time I go out I'd be willing to debate that

as long as the sensor position isnt covered by a camera there could be some fun to be had with this

get your bike practically on top of the sensor, and when a car drives past rev the hell out of your bike so it sets of the camera and takes a pic of the car hehe

I still mantain that any descision taken on any element of road law enforcment in this country is primarily based on cost over expected fine revenue. Cameras and sensors are cheap to install and can generate huge ammounts of revenue so will get the go ahead every time over proper policeing. Slightly of topic but have you seen that Southhampton has offered free council tax to anyone becoming a "hobbie bobby" this of course has nothing to do with the dismal uptake of the scheme in Southhampton and their also wanting to cut the police force strength by 50 officers at the same time. How do they expect to mantain law and order with this sort of policy?

It seems a daft amount of effort to put in all these sensors for the number of bikes actually on the road but hey ho






'Fraid I can't agree with you there, Jo, mate. Speed limits are set for a reason. Yes, the motorway speed limit may be ridiculous especially when you consider the likes of the german autobahn as well as the fact that cars are more powerful (and safer) now than they were when the original limit was set.

However, when you look to Single track A and B roads, I have to disagree with you. Speed limits are there for a reason. SAFETY. When you're out with your little girls on your bicycles or out on your horse you don't want to be taken out by some pr*ck doing 100mph because it gives him a rush do you?? If we speed then we choose to break the law and throw safety to the wind and to some extent our respect of others in our community. As BG pointed out, just because a speed limit is national, it doesn't mean that its safe for that road. I can think of plenty of nationals where I haven't even got up to 60 because the conditions have been wrong. Don't worry, I'm not riding around like I've got my nan on the back (no offence BG!), i'm perfectly happy to "ride it like I stole it" when I want to but if I speed and get caught then I'll have to hold my hands and say 'sorry officer, guilty as charged'.

I'm not meaning to sound pious because everyone does it but you and I both know when you go round some fab bend leaning her over at some ridiculous speed you're always one step away from disaster (no matter how experienced you are). If you're lucky then the disaster will be a few cuts and bruises and a mashed up bike. If you're not then it could mean some innocent child or rambler run over or even another biker taken out as you plough out of the corner out of control because you're going too fast for the road.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is lets not make the speed limits into and argument about 'them' trying to ruin our fun. Its about safety - ours and everyone elses.....

Deep intake of breath Rant over

slopes off

It was more the motorway speed limit i was on about,
I can only see raising that as being a good thing,
the points you raised about A and B roads are very valid though.
Though, if you look at the IOM there are no speed limits on the roads once you are out of built up areas,
and you dont read or hear of other road users being bug splatted,
well you do, but that is mainly when the TT or some other race is held.
Very sencibly our countryside A and B roads mostly have a posted speed limit of 50 or 60 mph and we are made aware of other road users and the dangers to look out for,
which means that they as road users should be well aware of the dangers too.
Riding to the road or weather conditions is a different topic to posted or national speed limits.

on a side note if p2p was made ilegal the company i work for would go bust putting 100 people out of a job

Gatso are bad, but you can see them, it adds to game a bit. Now i disagree with the point to point system. as some one who drives for my living i am in constant fear of loosing my licence, and during these P2P 50mph or whatever the limit is i am consentrating so hard on not 'creaping' over that my awarness of the raod is dramaticly impared.

The MCN is known for telling us 'the end is nigh', but if this is being implamented i would like to know when and were.

But i think the interesting point in this is taht it is ONLY bikes being watched, that has to be discrimination some how?

We all know that your position and speed can be taken at any given time by sat nav. its only a matter of time before all new cars/bikes ect are fited with a black box that will automaticly produce a NIP for any infraction of the limits. We have seen tests that will automaticly reduce your speed to 30...

To play devils advocate, you could drive at 45mph and have 5mph of leeway, if you need more leeway then add it, you dont have to drive AT 50mph, its the maximum limit you should never exceed.

I'm of mixed feelings now, I used to say that it wasnt speed that kills, however then I had a narrow miss from a driver who was unable to stop in time and clipped my arm.

There are some absolute fecking eejits on the road who cant drive at the legal speeds, and no matter what you say this country will not legislate these people off the roads. The only way you will stop these people killing people is to bring the speed limits so low that any impact will be non serious. You cannot do such a thing with un-enforced limits as these self same people will happily speed as they consider themselves good drivers. Gatsos are even worse as they just slam on the anchors metres before the camera and speed up again afterwards. The only way to ensure they never break the speed limit is to enforce every single mm of road in this country.

Now I really dont like that, I'd rather you got the bad drivers off the road and then raised limits where is was safe to do so (and that would be over 70mph). However if you are unwilling to do so and a zero-road-casualty figure is your goal (as has been repeatedly stated by road safety campaigners) then I dont see any other way you can do so.

In this case though, the question has to be asked was it his speed that caused the incident or the fact that he was not paying attention?

If he had seen you then he would have been able to reduce his speed safely so it can only be assumed that the cause was inattentive driving.

The only other scenario that I can see for this without knowing the full situation is that it was a manoevre by yourself that put you in his path causing him to be unable to stop in which case the fault would have been yours for misjudging the speed he was travelling.

Not saying it is your fault, just looking at the angles on this and not really seeing how the speed was the issue. As I say, I don't know the full story and am just hypothesising from what was written above

I posted it in full here in another thread but basically I was in front of him on the dual carriageway and there was an accident up ahead, I stopped in time he didnt. Just like the MANY rear end shunts you hear about every day.

So basically his speed was too high for *his* ability to stop in, whether that is due to his attention span or not is by the by, my point was that the ONLY way to slow down drivers like that is through enforcement.

Driver was your typical 30 to 40 something driving a large family saloon/executive type car

OK, thanks for the recap. I would still say that it is down to driver error and not the speed he was travelling though. If he was driving attentively he would have anticipated the braking. As it appears he was not I would expect the same outcome if he was doing 50, 40 or 30.

As said, this is just me also playing Devil's Advocate, but I firmly believe that speed is being made into the scapegoat that allows poor drivers to remain on the roads.

My own opinion is that the roads would be made much safer if speed cameras were converted to measure distance between cars instead of speed and prosecute tailgaters who are far more dangerous than someone going slightly over the limit.

Unfortunately that would mean the government admitting that speed is only a potential contributing factor to the general low standard of driving prevalent on the roads and would make it harder to justify reducing the police presence and also the extent of their little yellow cash boxes.

That is exactly what it is, which is precisely my point. I believe I covered it with



This country is not deciding road policy based on skilled, competent and attentive drivers, however since it wont take steps to ensure those are the only people using the roads, then maybe that is the safest way?

If your going to allow bad drivers to use the roads, then the only way to stop accidents (or rather casualties) is to effectively turns the roads and road vehicles into fairground dodgems.

Finn, I think I understand what you're suggesting.

We need a man to walk in front of each motor vehicle with a red flag. Now why hasn't this been thought of before?

On motorways/ dual carriageways with forward facing specs cameras I almost always observe the limit if there's any traffic around. Why? Because it's too dangerous to do otherwise. You daren't filter.

The drivers (or at least a very high proportion of them) adopt one of two modes:

1. Travel at 50MPH on the button, eyes exclusively glued to their speedo- utterly clueless as to what's happening around them.

2. Travel several MPH below the limit & use the time usefully to attend to unanswered texts/ voicemail/ makeup/ notes from the meeting.

Have you spent any time on the 55MPH limit multi lane highways in the States? Ever wondered exactly how the fcuk did anyone manage to drive off a straight piece of road, with no corner visible horizon to horizon and no other vehicle was involved!?!

I'm not suggesting anything, just trying to explain what I think is the current mentality aimed at trying to reduce casualties on the roads, its just I may not be arguing as vehemently against that viewpoint as I once was.

Yes but no matter how many car drivers drive like pricks they're never going to have the same statistics as we are when spinning off the cat and fiddle because of a lack of talent.

I'm not arguing with the discrimination though It seems recently that pretty much everyone is out for us at the moment




Now that, I totally agree with

I had a root around on the Essex Police web site last night & couldn't see anything to give the game away, but I think they might be having a crack down. The last two nights they've had the chopper up over the A13 and Mrs 849 told me that it was buzzing all over Burnham on Saturday, with loads of ground troops to back it up.

I can't figure it out: most of the roads out Burnham way do not have the visibility for excessive speed- I pretty much always take the CB out there, which isn't capable of what I think of as excessive speed, and I've never been overtaken by another biker, ever. I've passed a few, but in the twisties and within the speed limit- ish.

Are they just wasting monumental amounts of money trying to make bikers paranoid, or is there some stretch of road out there where everyone wheelies/ stoppies & does monster burnouts that I don't know about?

As far as the A13 goes the biggest problem is people racing on there, but I'd have thought they'd do a bit of preparation & check the road first, again making the chopper a big waste of money?

I think it's lower burnham road that's the problem... I've often seen a camera van along there and I've had a few people tank it past me on a couple of stretches.

Only if people realise that the weather means that they should slow down. Speed limits have to account for those with limited experience of skill level therefore they tend to be on the lowerside.

Must be the only thing buzzing around Burnham - it ain't exatly tinsel town!

Agree about teh roads there - quite a nice rid but definitely not haring tearing country - what a waste of effort.

That's the only stretch I could think of where the visibility is reasonable (for about half a mile), but the hedges are high enough to hide an old fashioned tractor and not that far back.

Never seen a scamera van there, ta Graham.