I cannot believe I did this...

About a month ago I bought a K4 GSXR600 - what a great bike.

So I went for a ride on sunday - nice sunny day, why not?

Got about 10 miles from home, noticed I needed petrol, so pulled into a BP. Looked at the pumps - "Unleaded 95" - nah, I want premium unleaded - "Diesel" definitely not! - "Premium" ah, that must be the stuff! 12 litres and £16 later, I go to pull out of the station "hmmm, why have I got no power? and why is there smoke billowing out of my exhaust?"

You may have guessed it - that "Premium" was actually "Premium Diesel". (Seriously, since when has there been 2 grades of diesel? I've never noticed it before, and alot of the guys I've talked to didn't know about them either)

I managed to get some tubing and siphoned off as much of the diesel as I could (I took out at least 11 litres) and refilled the bike with the 95 unleaded, but she just wouldn't start. Tried bump-starting her but still nothing.

The bike was probably running on the diesel for 30 seconds or so before I killed the engine.

What do I need to do to get the bike starting again? The AA guy that bought me and the bike home said that because it was running for such a short time it should be ok - but he couldn't get it started back at my place either (though all he did was press the starter button ). He did say that I may have gummed up the spark plugs.

The bike is due for it's 15,000 mile service (was going to get it done while I'm on holiday in late october) so I could of course get it fixed up at the same time as the service, but is it a small enough job that I can get it up and running (without causing any damage of course) so I can use it in the meantime?

Tonight (if I don't have to work late) I'm going to take out the plugs and clean them up, and get some injector cleaner and see if I can squirt it directly through the fuel line or something. Any other ideas?

I have access to a wide range of tools, and I've performed many an oil/filter/plug change before, so I can do the smaller jobs no worries.

The plugs will more than likely be fouled so they will need to be removed and cleaned. Make sure you've flushed all of the diesel out of the system or they'll foul again. If there is a catalytic converter in the exhaust that may well be buggered too so may need replaced.

Yep - clean the plugs. Also, diesel is more viscous than petrol - it shouldn't have affected your fuel filter, but you're right in considering injector cleaner. On the bright side, it *shouldn't* affect your cat - it was always lead that caused problems with those, reacting with the palladium inside.

If you have a petrol car, I'd take the syphoning tube to it again. Dump what's in the tank (and is now mixed with diesel) into your car, making it much more diluted. Your car's injectors are also much bigger and happier at dealing with crappy petrol, so they shouldn't gum up. Even when you put stale, waxy crap through them

If you're looking at filling the car up anyway, and are prepared to spend a little time at it, fill the bike with fresh petrol, mix it up, syphon it to the car, and keep going until the car's filled. Each time it makes the diesel much more dilute, and means it'll have much less effect when you do start it (take *that*, homeopathists...)

Beyond that, I don't see you having a problem. The petrol will flush it all out eventually, and any residue in the valves/cylinders will be blown clear/burned off soon enough.

Must admit I've never seen Premium Diesel. I have however started to put unleaded in my Landy but lucky realised after a couple of litres and completely filled the rest up with diesel - another 80 odd litres. I was still worried enough to call the AA before I drove anywhere but they said it would be OK - after sending a man out to check and doing some careful calculations. I had to keep topping it up after using a few litres for a while but then it was sorted.

Hopefully when you have cleaned the plus etc - your bike will be OK too.

I have done exactly the same when I was new to bikes. V confused by the premium names and also thought i had filled up with premium unleaded. And it also happened at a BP station, one of my first visits to a different petrol station from where I used to go before. Never used to drive a car in the UK so was new to petrol stations. I had to have the carbs cleaned and everything. I remember cycling back after a few days, as I didn't know what had happened and some people on a forum started to suggest in a kind way that maybe i had filled up with diesel. And yes the pump said diesel premium diesel I even took a picture with my mobile, why I don't know. I actually went on a ride-out that day with a new friend, I only topped up instead of a full tank, but the bike seriously misbehaved and wouldn't start first time. But yes still went on a ride-out somewhere in rural west sussex. First time ever... Those were the days, I can laugh about it now.

Got to ask why you wanted premium unleaded in the first place? Does bugger all except empty your wallet quicker.

It works better in high-performance, high-compression engines. But not by much. Less pinking if you're caning it hard, and a teeny bit more power. Yes, it'll empty your wallet faster, and in town you'll never notice. Even out of town you'd have to be a very naughty boy to see a difference. Maybe on a trackday it'd be worthwhile.

My RX8 has a sticker next to the fuel filler to say Premium Unleaded Only. The compression on that Renesis engine is pitiful compared to either of my bikes though, so I just laugh and ignore it. Actually, given how much petrol it likes to drink, I tend to cry and ignore it, but no matter...

Oh, and Nemo - I've seen BP Ultimate Diesel. Don't know what's so clever about it. Maybe they put in a ha'penny's worth of detergent and charge you 15p per litre extra - wouldn't surprise me anyway.

Either way, I'll be sticking to the regular stuff. Does me just fine.

It can improve BHP if the engine supports adaptive timing. Your latest hot hatches, evo's and scooby-do's can get signifiicant performance improvements. I seem to remember a car mag getting as much as 40-50bhp more on the dyno out of a scooby imprezza.

On any bike though it makes buggerall difference as the FI isnt as adaptive as on cars. Well unless you manually advance the ignition timing yourself of course. However most bikes are setup to run fine with the sh!te they get in the states and dont automatically advance the timing so any regular unleaded over here has more than a high enough octane rating.

I _nearly_ got her going!!

I took out the spark plugs (thank god the previous owner was as OCD as I am, and the bike came with the original toolkit - dunno how I would have got the plugs out without it) and they were black as hell. Gave them a good clean (yeah, I should replace them, but that will be done at her next service in a few weeks, and it's hard to find bike plugs within walking distance of my place at 6pm at night ) and put it back together.

I must say I was impressed at how easy it was - even though it's a fairly cramped space, and I've got fairly large hands, it wasn't a problem at all.

I wanted to drain the tank again, but didn't have .... well, I was going to say a fuel can or a piece of hose, but really, I was just too lazy I had managed to get some fuel injector cleaner at the local servo, so put about a third of that in (the bottle said it would treat 50 odd litres, so didn't want to put too much in) and sloshed the tank around to mix it up as well as possible.

A few squirts of "start-ya-bastard", and she was trying bloody hard to go! I actually managed to get her going for a few seconds, but it was only a halfhearted effort.

Of course, I spent too long on the starter button, and now the battery is a tad flat! whoops! (and I'm sure I'll have to re-clean the plugs )

Anyway, I've got the battery on the charger, so I'll have a bit of dinner, and see if I can get her going a bit later.

Thanks for all you help folks! I'll let you know how I get on!

Riv

oh dear however, you are not alone. I had an early start one morning and still somewhat asleep put petrol in my diesel golf oops. She sputtered to a stop a few hundred yards from the petrol station!! According to the garage who sorted out my blunder putting diesel in a petrol engine is worse Anyhoo, consequently I'm a bit more vigilant about what's going in the tank now - esp on my bike.....Don't worry, I'm sure you'll get it sorted, and the others seem to think its not going to be too big a job.

On the other subject, I had noticed they have two grades of diesel but I only ever buy it if there's nothing else on offer....I think its just a marketing ploy to get you to spend more.....

Take off the tank and drain out the rest of the diesel. You indicated that you had left some in plus you will have the reserve stuff as well, Trust me Dp and I have been there and got the certificate for numptyness. cheers mally

awww man!

I was just about to let you guys know that I just got her going!

For the first 2 minutes or so it was pretty rough, and smokey as all hell, but as the less concentrated diesel/more concentrated petrol started to get through it started running smoother and smoother (and sounding more like she usually does - not spluttery and coughy)

I let her idle for 5 minutes or so, and by the end she was running fairly smoothly - still smoking a bit, but approaching normal.

I was hoping that I could just keep up with the injector cleaner for the next several tank-fulls (if I get through that much) and just get everything else done during the service?

yes? no?

That would *probably* be okay, but I'd dilute the fuel with unleaded. You shouldn't need to take the tank of so long as you're halfway competent at syphoning. You won't get it *all* out, but as I said above, just keep emptying it into the car, filling it with fresh petrol, and emptying it into the car again. It'll take a bit of time, but it'll dilute the diesel right down. At the very least I'd empty what's in there (which will have a fair amount of diesel in it still) and get a fresh tank of fuel. Check the plugs every couple of days and make sure you run it pretty-much empty before you refil for the next few weeks.

Once you've got through the first couple of tanks you should be fine, so wait until then before changing the plugs for your service. Might as well run the crap though the old plugs.

Does no one look at the colour of the pumps these days?
Premium deisel has been on the market for ages.

Sorry to hear bout your mishap though Oldie.

Here's a question...

The general concensus is that the bike *should* be fine. But what *could* go wrong with it?

I realise the plugs could (and have) foul up, and I guess some of the crud could get stuck in the muffler and harm performance somehow in there... but is there anything else that could go wrong?

I'm sure if I tried to run it with 50% diesel and 50% petrol that would be enough to cause some serious damage - ruining piston rings? cracking heads? but surely with the tiny amount of diesel left in the tank now it would be ok (apart from smoking like cack and cruddy performance of course)?

I drained the tank again last night, so now there should be even less of that damned diesel in there!

(is it obvious that I know feck all about engines? :P )

Got an 80 mile ride tomorrow, so that should be ... ... ... ... interesting?

I've never filled up with diesel, instead of petrol, before but if I noticed straight away that I'd done it I would just drain the carbs, syphon the tank and add fresh fuel.
When I've added redex straight through plugholes before it makes the bike smoke like mad for a couple of miles but then it clears. I'd have thought that's what would happen with diesel.

A wee footnote - took my bike out to a mates place on the weekend - the 80 mile trip I talked about - and no worries, awesome ride. The gixxer ran smooth as, no coughs or hiccups, and certainly didn't notice any lack of power.

Though I have found something I don't like about her - it's bloody hard to only ride at 70 mile an hour! It just does 60/70/80/90 mph so easily! Accidentally hit 97mph at one stage

Though I have found something I don't like about her - it's bloody hard to only ride at 70 mile an hour! It just does 60/70/80/90 mph so easily! Accidentally hit 97mph at one stage
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Think you will find its the same with any big bike

The problem with diesel in a petrol engine has to do with the ignition of the fuel mainly. petrol is a highly flammable liquid and the spark plug is there to ignite it after the compression stroke. diesel is not very flammable in itself, in a diesel car the glow plug is there to heat the fuel in the cylinder when it is starting but once this is done the heat generated by the compression stroke of the engine is enough to ignite the fuel.
petrol engines have a much lower compression ratio than diesels so the fuel is not compressed enough to ignite and the spark has no effect meaning that the fuel just sits there. if you run the engine for a while the build up of diesel will clog the engine up.
reversely if you put petrol into a diesel engine the combination of highly flammable fuel and high compression can blow head gaskets, warp cylinder heads, crack barrels and generally destroy the engine.

When you put Petrol into a Diesel engine. The main thing that happens is that it fecks the Pump/Injectors. Diesel Oil is exactly that. It lubricates the extremely fine tolerances (2 Microns) found in Diesel fuel systems. Water is also good for pumps as it washes the lube off just as good as Petrol. 40 years as a Diesel fitter I have seen it all.